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I saw this on the Gamecube message boards over at IGN...I was really bored today...check out the link for the interview that it's talking about...the lady really is a puppet that doesn't know what's going on and can't give any good comebacks...just workarounds that doesn't admit anything. The keyword in the interview was "perception". I nearly laughed my head off.

link: http://cube.ign.com/articles/387/387510p1.html






The faces of Nintendo!


DENIAL!
"Why are you in third place?

We're not, actually. In reality, we're in first place. Remember, Nintendo does not compete against Sony and Microsoft because Nintendo is unique -- we're in first place."


FAKE DISAGREEMENT IN PERCEPTION!
"Nintendo constantly plays catch-up with Sony and Microsoft. Why?

We don't. Really, your perception is just incorrect and ours is the correct perception, so you're just wrong. Give it up. We don't look at our competitors -- we look at ourselves. It's just a huge, ever-occurring coincidence that we announce similars plans to those of our competitors just days after they announce theirs."


QUESTION AVOIDANCE!
"Doesn't it hurt Nintendo so be so 'unique'?

Game Boy Advance rocks!"


ROUTE THE QUESTION TO SOMEONE ELSE!
"Why did Sega drop its sports line-up?

I have no clue. Ask Sega! I don't even know why I work for this company, because I have no clue what happens in it and its licensees."

"Isn't a lack of sports games bad for folks who want sports games?

I have no clue. Ask the gamers! I wouldn't want to put words in their mouths."


FALSE ANSWERS!
"Is Nintendo opposed to paying for third-party exclusives?

No."


UNWARRANTED SECRECY!
"Will you be at E3?

Maybe."

"Will there be games at E3?

No comment."

"Will E3 take place?

It may. I can't say for sure."

"What games might be at E3?

Bye."

Well I can't read the article because I'm not an "IGN Insider," and since most of those quotes are utterly ridiculous and sound more like satire, no offense, but I'm disbelieving this one. <rolls d20> Alright, a 20! Yeah, it's gone. Doesn't exist.

Ok then...here's the actual article....forgive me if it's a little messy...I'm copying-and-pasting.




GameCube Interview
We ask NOA's Perrin Kaplan the hard questions about GameCube's present and future in the industry. Must read interview.









February 27, 2003 - Between cancellations of Sega Sports games for GameCube and a general unwillingness by US third-parties to throw their full support behind the system, Nintendo fans have recently had it rougher than normal. So earlier today when we strolled into Nintendo's suite at the Hard Rock Hotel and Casino in Las Vegas, we wanted to know just what, if anything, the company intended to do about it.
Nintendo of America Jedi councilwoman and vice president of corporate affairs Perrin Kaplan met us. Pregnant with a Jedi-in-the-making -- congratulations, the seasoned executive fielded our concerns about the GameCube and clarified Nintendo's plans for the future.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

IGNcube: Why is Nintendo GameCube number-three in US console sales?

Perrin: Are we really number three?

IGNcube: Sales wise, yes.

Perrin: It depends on how you count it. Honestly, people make that statement as if it's a given and I think it really depends on any given day at any given retailer. It's not a clear third -- sometimes we're in second -- and a variety of things can happen. The last month we've had a couple different great programs at retail that are working very, very well. The whole 'pick one of the four games' campaign has increased sales and is doing very well and meanwhile the Zelda presale is very strong.

The beginning of a year was really a slow start for us and that's because there was a dearth of really good products. So I guess my answer is to you that we're aware what our position is and what we want to do with it. It's not up to Nintendo quality. So there's a lot of different things that we're working on in retail.

IGNcube: You mentioned the free GCN title promotion. Just how well has that done for Nintendo?

Perrin: It's gone very, very well. I was just trying to get some new numbers this morning -- it's gone very well. It's great because the games that we're offering are very popular and are games that people really want. And it's nice because it's kind of a new thing for Nintendo to have something so broad and it's also good for the consumers. We've got some really good stuff going, we're showing that it's increasing numbers, that it's moving consumers, and that's what we wanted to see.

I have to always say that Nintendo is always talking about what we can do at retail and what retailers want. You know, you could say that one company does something in response to another, but I would say that it only becomes one hundred percent relevant when it comes to pricing wars. But, Nintendo, as always, has sort of done its own thing and a lot of it has to do with, well, we know consumers really love our product, but what can we do to further ignite things? It really came down to the software.


Perrin on the successor to GameCube, 320x240 video
IGNcube: In the past, Nintendo has played the reaction game to Microsoft and Sony's first moves. Will Nintendo become the move maker?

Perrin: That's so interesting because that's your perception. And if you talk to Nintendo about the Nintendo philosophy, we've always done things uniquely. While you might say that we're spending time looking at what our competitors are doing, honestly we're looking at what we're doing with ourselves.



Perrin promotes the new GBA SP


Nintendo has always operated in a very independent fashion, much to the frustration sometimes of outsiders who would like to see us do things a certain way. You have to remember that we're a very Japan-based company and I think we function with a slightly different philosophy. Microsoft is an American company that is very aggressive and outward and Nintendo operates different. We're not necessarily interested in daily trench warfare. We're more interested in continuing to perfect what we do. So the questions you have about what we could be doing better are things that we have been asking ourselves.


IGNcube: Do you think it hurts Nintendo that it thinks of itself as being so unique -- that it's a company that doesn't play by the same rules as Microsoft and Sony?
Perrin: Well, I think that obviously in the portable market our position rocks -- it's a great position and any company would love to have it. And even if you look the profit of where we are with our console, companies would love to have that. If you compared our success and profit, even per hardware system to where Microsoft's at, they are absolutely galaxies apart. So if people are trying to make a judgment, they really are apples to oranges. Nintendo is always watching two things for itself: how can it better what it does and how can it maintain a profit for itself. We're a very successful company -- more than 100 years old, no debt, a lot of cash, a very unique position particularly in this economy.

Microsoft is trying to make a go of Xbox. But if you look at their profits, the reason they got hit corporately is because of the huge [Xbox] losses. I mean, they have admitted they will lose money into perpetuity and that's just not the kind of road that Nintendo will ever take. We just have two very different philosophies about approaching this business. Both may be successful, but we are just two different companies and our focus will always be on the games we want to produce.

IGNcube: Why did Sega drop its sports lineup on GameCube?

Perrin: Well, you'd have to ask the company, but I guess there's two different things: one is that companies have to do what's best for them at any given time depending on their own performance. I mean, THQ is under big pressure, Acclaim is under pressure, Activision is under pressure and Sega is clearly under pressure. That said, we've had a relationship with these companies for years and are continuing to have more and more conversations with them to revise and talk about what they are needing and what we can do together to make it something that's mutually beneficial.

The bottom line is that retailers really only want to carry games of really high quality that are going to sell so our challenge is figuring out how you do that together and what Nintendo can bring to the fold that would be more attractive to licensees and what licensees could bring to the fold that would be really attractive for Nintendo to purchase or make agreements over.

IGNcube: With Sega dropping its sports lineup on GCN does this paint the picture to consumers that GameCube is not a console to buy if you like sports games?

Perrin: You'd have to ask the gamers, but I guess that's probably an area that we'd like to be stronger in and it's something that we're aware of and taking a look at how we can accomplish that over the next 12 months.

IGNcube: Miyamoto recently mentioned that Nintendo is specifically in talks with Electronic Arts about developing sports games with GBA/GCN link functionality. Is that true?

Perrin: Yeah, that's fair to say. I think that's fair. We're in talks. There will hopefully be more to be heard later.

IGNcube: At E3?

Perrin: Definitely at E3.

IGNcube: So is Nintendo doing anything to entice third-parties to stick with GameCube?





Perrin: Yeah, we're looking at what we can bring to the fold and what they can bring to the fold and some different ways of doing things. The licensees are under a different challenge than they've ever been in that there is so much software being shoveled to retailers and there is only so much space and retailers are saying that unless there are big marketing budgets they aren't going to place it. So there is pressure on the licensees and the publisher and a little bit on the hardware manufactures too. So if there is a really good game to be had we'll help with it.

IGNcube: Is Nintendo opposed to paying third-party developers for exclusives?

Perrin: I don't think we're opposed to anything that would yield a really positive benefit for the consumer in terms of the game quality. I mean, anything's possible. I wouldn't make the assumption that we're going to do any certain thing, but again, anything is possible.


IGNcube: Microsoft worked out a nice limited exclusive with Splinter Cell on Xbox, and the game went on to sell better than Metroid Prime.
Perrin: That's been a really great thing for them. I think it's a little bit of a unique situation because they have not been able to make that happen with other titles. So it's definitely their challenge.

IGNcube: Why is Nintendo so secretive?

Perrin: Secretive is another perception word. It depends on how you want to run your company.

IGNcube: To clarify secretive, then, here's an example: immediately following the huge success of Halo, Microsoft announces that a sequel is underway and shows off a teaser trailer of the game -- still more than a year away, all to build hype. By contrast, Nintendo intentionally keeps the sequel to Metroid Prime a complete secret. Why?

Perrin: I just that's how Microsoft wants to introduce their product lineup. Mr. Miyamoto is not as comfortable divulging a lot -- he wants to save enough for consumers to be very excited about things when they see them. Yeah, we could probably show stuff a little bit earlier, but we certainly wouldn't do it like Microsoft does. It's just not our style -- we've never done that.

IGNcube: Do you think this hurts or helps Nintendo in the end?

Perrin: I think it depends upon what title you're talking about. We are the oldest company in the business and I think everything we've done so far has worked pretty well for us.

I think that if we'd shown Metroid Prime earlier, it probably wouldn't have done the product justice.

IGNcube: Does Nintendo have an image problem? Is GameCube unfairly perceived to be a kid's toy?

Perrin: I think probably the color of it has been a little bit more of a challenge for us than Platinum. Platinum and black have been really great. I think the thing that we've been missing the most is making a really good link between our products -- showing that we have products for everybody. I think we have tended to promote things in a very one-off fashion and not linked things together as much as we should. So we'll be focusing more on that in the next year. But in terms of what kind of products we have and the quality of them, what Nintendo does and how Miyamoto spends his time, I don't think we've made any mistakes there.

IGNcube: Nintendo has released some titles for older gamers, but these have always come from second- and third-parties. Why hasn't EAD made any games to appeal directly to older audiences?

Perrin: We've added those types of games as incremental -- they haven't been a replacement for anything. Asking Miyamoto to make Pikmin who drive around in cars like in Vice City is just not going to happen. It's just not who he is as an artist. To ask an artist to do a painting that wasn't part of who they are just wouldn't work. Miyamoto is best at what he does and what he does is brilliant.


Is Nintendo out of touch?, 320x240 video
That said, Nintendo and Miyamoto are very aware that we need to be continuing to make those other products and we're spending a lot of time with other companies doing that. I think that's what you've seen. Eternal Darkness is a really great example of that. Going out and having second parties and third-parties doing that, there's nothing wrong with that at all. But having Miyamoto do it, I think, would just be a huge mistake.



Perrin enjoys a game of Wind Waker


IGNcube: Are you excited about E3? Why?

Perrin: Because I love a good party! [Laughs]

IGNcube: What about the GameCube lineup?

Perrin: Yeah, actually I'm very excited about the lineup. We're excited. We're going to be doing things with some different venues this year. And Mr. Iwata in Japan continues to be very evolved, and that's exciting for us. They're viewing E3 as a worldwide show. We've got so many people that come from Europe in Japan, and for us the value of the show has definitely increased.

IGNcube: Mr. Iwata has said in the past that in 2003 Nintendo is going to show off some its original, innovative titles.

Perrin: And you want me to tell you what those are going to be?

IGNcube: Well, yes. Will these innovative original titles be at E3?

Perrin: I think so, yes. Iwata is spending a lot of time thinking about E3.

IGNcube: Can we expect GameCube surprises?
Perrin: I think so, yes.

IGNcube: Will Nintendo show a lot of GameCube titles?

Perrin: Yes.

IGNcube: How many?

Perrin: That I won't tell you. You'll have to come to E3 and see for yourself.

IGNcube: Will there be a successor to GameCube?

Perrin: Yes! Absolutely.

IGNcube: Is it in development now?

Perrin: Yes, we're working on it. Absolutely.

IGNcube: When will it come out?

Perrin: We're aiming for 2005.

IGNcube: Can you go ahead and tell us about all the partners involved? Thanks.

[Laughter]

Perrin: No. But you'll start hearing about them soon enough.

IGNcube: At E3?

Perrin: [Pauses] Maybe.

But trust me, we're working on stuff. We're always working on the next system. We're not sure how that rumor started where people think we aren't working on the next console. As Iwata so eloquently said: the day we don't release a new console is the day we get out of the business, period.

IGNcube: What's happening at Zoonami

Perrin: They're working on GameCube games.

IGNcube: To be unveiled at E3?

Perrin: That I can't tell you. But they're working on stuff.

IGNcube: What is your response to critics who say that Nintendo is out of touch with what gamers want?

Perrin: First, I have to remind you how profitable we remain and how many millions of products we continue to sell. I mean, obviously in our portable market we're not out of touch with anybody. But I think we need to do a better job of linking all of our products together and being ageless. We need to be a little bit louder about that.

IGNcube: The Game Boy Advance SP is a slicker, meaner machine that we're used to seeing from Nintendo. Is this hardware a sign of a new Nintendo to come?

Perrin: It's funny you ask that since we own 98% of the portable market share, I'm not sure how much newer we can get. The SP is just a really neat looking product. Everybody is really excited about it. I don't know if you saw the lines in Japan, but they ran out very quickly and retailers here are anxious to get the inventory numbers they want. I wouldn't say it's a new day for Nintendo. I would just say that it's another product that's been greatly enhanced and it's fabulous. It couldn't be more perfect.

IGNcube: Is there a GBA successor planned?

Perrin: Do you mean, are we working on something beyond GBA SP?

IGNcube: Yeah.

Perrin: Yes, we are.

IGNcube: You released a broadband modem, but no Nintendo online titles for GameCube. Why not?

Perrin: It goes back to the whole profit thing. We don't think there is as fruitful of a business there as everyone else is talking about. Nobody has made any money with it still. Microsoft and Sony have other desires in the home than Nintendo does -- we really have completely different focuses as companies. And if it becomes something more fruitful you'll see us be there. But until then it just doesn't make sense.


Perrin on Silicon Knights and Zoonami, 320x240 video
We have provided the adapter and we do have Phantasy Star Online, and there are some other companies that are looking into some stuff for it but we're not going out and racing to lose money.

IGNcube: Will Nintendo show online GameCube titles at E3?

Perrin: I can't tell you that -- you'll have to show up.

IGNcube: Is Ken Lobb laughing or crying right now?

Perrin Kaplan: Oh, you'll have to ask Ken.

IGNcube: Come on!

Perrin: You know how much he still loves Nintendo. But anything to do with videogames, he's going to love. He was sad to leave Nintendo and we were sad to see him go, but he was just happy to keep doing videogames.

IGNcube: Why'd he leave?

Perrin: You'll have to ask him.

IGNcube: What is happening with Pokemon GameCube?

Perrin: I guess you could say, as you would with a Mario game, that there's something always Pokemon in the works.

IGNcube would like to thank Nintendo for the interview.

Interview by Matt Casamassina and Fran Mirabella

I can understand why people are frustrated by and are making fun of this interview, but really if ya think about it, it is understandable.
With a Japanese business philosophy, Nintendo is bound to do things differently than US companies. Their whole thing about keepint tight-lipped and dancing around the issues is smart; by keeping things secret, they gain an edge over their competitors, who aren't able to see Nintendo's next move. Their seemingly over-confidence is smart, too; by making it appear that everything is under control and they have a few trump cards up their sleeve (which they probably do, judging by the way they're barely able to keep quiet about whatever they've got planned for E3), they encourage investment in the company. Nobody wants to invest in a company who doesn't even appear to have faith in itself. By appearing so confident, they dissuade a large amount of investor fear.
Nintendo's words and actions may seem stupid, but once you put them into a business perspective (because that's what Nintendo is, a business), it all makes sense, and isn't just a load of BS any longer.

Jack, thank you soo much.. I couldn't stop laughing my ass off.. Reading that has made my day. There were so many great quotes in there (well, great if you're not a Nintendo fanboy)... One of my personal favorites is:
"Microsoft worked out a nice limited exclusive with Splinter Cell on Xbox, and the game went on to sell better than Metroid Prime." hahahahahaah!

why is that funny?

Evil Magic Pirate wrote:Jack, thank you soo much.. I couldn't stop laughing my ass off.. Reading that has made my day. There were so many great quotes in there (well, great if you're not a Nintendo fanboy)... One of my personal favorites is:
"Microsoft worked out a nice limited exclusive with Splinter Cell on Xbox, and the game went on to sell better than Metroid Prime." hahahahahaah!

I'm not quite sure what's so funny about this. Their trying to keep people in suspense and keep to their business strategy. Not the "barking dog" (Penny-Arcade's word for it) way of Microsoft telling everything.

I've played both games, and I must say that Metroid comes out on top. I hate FP games, and I still like Metroid better. The controls on Splinter Cell were very clunky, and the framerate was very choppy. I was also extremely board the entire 30 minutes I put in. But, the boardom is based on opinion. Metroid Prime runs at its 60 fps with no problems, and looks much better to my eyes.

Splinter Cell will be on the Cube and the Ps2 anyway. Its the only game, for Xbox, nominated for an award... and its multiplatform.

Regarding the specific quote about Metroid and Splinter Cell >>>
Im laughing mainly becuase Break thinks so highly of Metroid, and so poorly of Splinter Cell.. Yet Splinter Cell out sold Metroid.. Ohh the delicious irony.. It has to be a kick-in-the-nuts for all Nintendo fans... And personally, I find other peoples grief to be somewhat humorous.

Regarding the Rest of it >>>
You can't read that and say the way the guy is 'dancing around the questions' isn't funny. Call it smart or dumb or whatever you want, but that still doesn't change the humor value of it. He goes all 'Evangelion Episode 26' on the IGN... Saying all this stuff about how Nintendo exist in its own reality, where Sony and Microsoft do not.. and that IGNs perception is different from Nintendos perception, and that you can't definitivly state which system has the best sale just by compair the number of consoles sold, etc... etc... The whole interview is a waste of time, everything he said was a ambigous, every question he answered with a definate maybe.

Are you talking about the satire he posted, or the real one?

And why aren't you logging in, EMP?

Its not uncommon for a better product to be outsold by a lesser one. There are more Fords sold than Mercedes, but that doesn't mean that Fords are better.

And it is your opinion that Splinter Cell is not as good as MP. However...Splinter Cell just won Console Game of the Year from the AIAS! An award that MP was also up for. Not to say that MP got held out from everything though, they did win the first-person shooter of the year award (I guess this means that you can't call it an FPA anymore ).

If you want the link, I'll be more than happy to post it, but I'm tired and I want to go to sleep.

BTW, business is business, and while Nintendo's strategy may still be working in Japan, it's definitely not doing its job over here. Oh yeah...one last thing....

MS + Sega = AMAZATRON! (hopefully)

-Kevin

For some reason my computer didn't auto log me in when I came to the forums, I didn't realize.. My bad.. That post from 'Guest' above belongs to me (as Break said).
Anyway, I was talking about the real post, not the satire... I think Perrin danced around the questions, and I found the vauge answers she gave very funny, jacks satire was spot on...

And Yes, it is common lesser products to outsell superior ones; but this is not really the case here.. A Mercedes is about $98732098 where a Ford is only $2.50; here S.Cell and Metroid are negligable in price difference. More oftehn than not, superior product outsell inferior ones.
Im really in no position to comment about which game is better though, but with all the Nintendo fans around here, its so funny that an Xbox title outsold one of Nintendos Flagship exclusives. Im sure you'd have to be a non-Nintendo-fanboy to see the humor.. Edit: I'd really bust a nut laughing if DOA volleyball outsold Metroid too.

Jack Burton wrote: BTW, business is business, and while Nintendo's strategy may still be working in Japan, it's definitely not doing its job over here.

I was thinking the exact same thing, I was going to post something about it but feared that Break, Siege and Ru would try and kill me or something. I totally agree with you Jack. Nintendos sale philosophies may work fine in Japan or in 'Nintendo Land: where Sony and MS dont exist' or whatever.. But this is America! They say they aren't " interested in daily trench warfare" and that they only want to perfect themselves.. Thats all well and good, but while Nintendo are off meditating, big aggressive MS and Sony will steal all their bases and say "All your base are blong to US!!"

First, what a shameless inclusion of such a marvelous phrase.
Secondly, ok, so maybe we're fools, maybe Break and Siege and I and Nintendo can't see what you guys call "reality" clearly, but there's an underlying philosophy behind our loyalty. Nintendo is our favorite company because in it we perceive something good: their faithfulness to making good games that qualify for art and their constant innovation that pushes the market ahead. In Microsoft and sometimes Sony, we perceive something evil: the greed that drives them to do anything that will increase their revenue, even if it hurts the market, the games themselves, or even the players (those damn controllers cause carpal tunnel, I swear ). Therefore when it comes down to it, to us it's a battle between good and evil. I know it sounds cheesy and crazy, but it's how we see things. So you can understand why we get so upset when something happens in M$'s favor; no one likes to see evil win, but then again, if evil has good games that appeal to the right age bracket, why not, eh?
I will never be shaken on my stance about the Xbox because it would literally take God himself coming down and telling me Gabriel the archangel was running M$ while posing as Gates to change my mind, and even then I'd have a hard time believing it. I've watched Microsoft's shady practices for too long, over a decade, and I know what they are capable of doing.
Break, Siege, and I have faith in our company, a faith that borders on the spiritual. Frankly, if I knew that my death would somehow mean that M$ would lose the console race, I'd be very hard pressed to make a decision, and probably lean towards the self-sacrifice. And I'm being completely serious.

look... Bill Gates is a cocksucker, alright. He loves the cock. LOVES it. That's how he got so big in business.. sucking dick. IBM, Dell, Intel, Compaq.. they've all had their dicks sucked by Gates. He's the biggest man-whore this side of equator. Now, it may be that he does a fine job sucking the cock. In fact, they say that he's really good at the sucking. He sucks harder than any man has ever sucked before.

See now the thing is, the Japanese don't like to get there cocks sucked by men. Gates said to Nintendo, "Hey, I'll suck your cock if you give up your Gamecube." Now see, the things is, for a gaming company, their console is kind of like their penis. It's where the blood goes, it's where the excitement comes from, what makes them feel alive. Of course for Gates, Windows is obviously the penis, X-Box falls more along the lines of eye-shadow or something. Artificial, not really neccessary, just doesn't fit.

So you see, Gates is essentially trying to cut off Nintendo's penis, and that's just cruel. I mean, no man deserves such a horrible fate.

...just thought I'd explain things in terms you guys would understand

Nintendo is at least still making a profit, something Microsoft can not say. Nintendo has remained profitable for the 114 years they've been in business. (Began in 1889.)

Metroid Prime actually got First Person Actions game of the year. According to IGN ,anyway. I still consider it first person adventure, because it is different than and FPS I've played. Its also the only one I've liked. I was very skeptical, because I expected to like Halo. Metroid, thankfully, did not let me down. To me, and several others, it is a FP Adventure.

Nintendo isn't winning in sales in the recent years. But, to me they are winning in quality. (My opinion) Their working on coming out on top, and as long as they stay around I'm happy. It'd be nice to be #1, and I hope they make it. But, its not necessary. We're still getting strong support from Capcom and now Konami. And my favorite development house; Nintendo.

Gamers are the most fickle audience on the planet. Ditching one company for the current best. This is how many business's work, however. Buy the current company's project, then circle them with buzzards with your done.

Personally, I don't think Nintendo is done. As Perrin said, "We're not going anywhere."

I really don't want people to look into this too much...but the only two reasons that nintendo remained profitable in 2002 were:

1. GBA

2. The sale of Rare...it was for $300 Million.

If somebody wants to post some numbers and a link with it to prove me wrong, you're more than welcome to, but I don't think you're gonna. MS knows they're gonna lose money this generation to build userbase...they're banking on Xbox Next vs. PS3. That's when the real battle will be fought.

And in other news, Miyamoto-san himself said this:

Shigeru Miyamoto: I can't really say a whole lot about E3 right now, but Nintendo is still at a point where we don't currently see online games as a business model being successful so I don't think you can expect to see any serious look at online games [for GameCube] at E3.

link: http://cube.ign.com/articles/387/387710p2.html

Meaning that from the man himself, there is almost no chance of an online Animal Crossing or Mario Kart. However, in the article, he also added that they are looking into the possibility of linking GameCube's together in LAN's ala PS2's iLink or Xbox LANs. Who knows? Miyamoto-san does, and he's not talking until E3....which I'll be at! Haha!

One last thing: GMR magazine gave Wind Waker a 9 out of 10. They loved it, except for the last 1/4 of the game...they said the pace grinded to a screeching halt. Wanna see the full review? Check out your local EB.

-Kevin