BreakmanX.com

Mericks wrote:

Vamp wrote:Paying $5 for a 20 year old game + $8 for a 15 year old game + $10 for a 10 year old game = fuck that shit.

Anything that can be played on the virtual console and then some I can play for free on my TV with a transfinite selection of games, the ability to actually map good controls, and even with better graphical smoothing techniques like 2-Sai on my Xbox.

Not to mention I can play any of them except N64 (well I can, but they're too slow and buggy) on the go for free on my PSP.

Time does not make an amazing game into a bad game Vamp. Maybe some day you too, will understand this. ALttP is 1 of the best ways to spend $8...Kid Icarus is 1 of the best ways to spend $5...Bomberman '93 is 1 of the best ways to spend $6...MK64 or SM64 are fantastic ways to spend $10.

So yeah...Vamp....Screw you and you lack of quality knowledge as well as your bootleg versions of games. If everyone were like you, then games would've ended in production long ago when no companies were making any money and you wouldn't have that PSP in your hands in the 1st place because of that.

someones a tad bit touchy O_O

Someone's being a bit of a gigantic cunt. Yes, LttP is amazing, and it's my favorite Zelda of all time. However, in order to put it on Wii it cost Nintendo almost nothing whatsoever. All they had to do was put the rom into their emulator, slap a Zelda graphic on the launch icon, and put it up for sale. That's it.

So how much should they be charging for it? The most I'd pay to buy LttP today, especially without a box via online purchase, maybe a tenth of what they're selling it for. 80 cents, max. If it were the original cart with a box, then I might consider spending $8 on it.

Time doesn't make a good game bad at all, I know this better than anyone. BUT, the time has already passed when Nintendo and all the other developers of decades old games have made plenty of profit on their games.

Oh and by the way, the "bootlegs" I'm playing are the EXACT SAME ROMS you're playing on your Wii. The difference? I can map my own controls. I can use save states. I can upscale the graphics and apply filtering. I can take it anywhere I want on a portable console. I can get them without being nickled and dimed to death, and enjoy playing as many games as I want.

Ok, the bootlegs you're playing may be the same as I'm playing, but that's completely irrelevant to what I said. You're literally robbing Nintendo when you play them, and if everyone did that, game companies never would've made any money at all, and then they never would've progressed through the times to now, and you wouldn't have that PSP in your hands. All because the companies were putting games out there only to have them ripped and put online to be stolen by people like you.

Also, spending 80 cents on ALttP is fuckin' ridiculous. I mean I can get a pack of fuckin' Hostess donuts for 80¢ and they're not even nearly as good as ALttP. Hell, the fuckin' $1 bottles of Pepsi I get aren't even worth a copy of ALttP. I mean if I was given a choice of 8 bottles of pop or ALttP, I'd go for the fuckin' game.

Also, Vamp, if you don't believe that age makes a game worse, then I suggest you say that $5 is a bad price for a 20 year old game, especially since in tact copies of some NES or SNES games are hard to come by nowadays and thus prices on them are constantly going up. I know several people that've taken advantage of that fact too.

Btw, as long as we play the game on which emulator is better, your bootlegs or my VC games, I should let you know that my TV is most likely bigger than your computer monitor. Also, my living room chair is more comfortable than my computer chair. I somehow think that fact holds true for you too.

Is your reason for bootlegging solely price, or do you have moral objection to playing the games?

Just curious. A lot of the books I've been reading lately deal with morals and the need or lack of need for laws to make the morals actually work.

If no one bought games, then companies wouldn't make them and things like the virtual console would not exist.. I agree with Mericks there. What would be your ideal system to which you would pay for games.

At what point is a game old enough to which it should be free to the public... or is there a point? In Britain, for example, things enter the public domain and are free after fifty years.

BreakmanX wrote:If no one bought games, then companies wouldn't make them and things like the virtual console would not exist.. I agree with Mericks there. What would be your ideal system to which you would pay for games.

At what point is a game old enough to which it should be free to the public... or is there a point? In Britain, for example, things enter the public domain and are free after fifty years.

I think that things should be more expensive after a long time when they're harder to find and grab hold of...

And to be honest with my moral views on pirated games, I can't be sure. There's something going on in my head about it that I want to try to put into words, but I can't do it properly.

Mericks wrote:You're literally robbing Nintendo when you play them

Actually I'm quite literally not. For starters, it's copyright infringement, not theft. It's also of no loss to Nintendo for me to download it anyway since I wouldn't have bought it from them in the first place (the only way to purchase say LttP online is through the Virtual Console, and I wouldn't spend $8 on it). The only other way to legally get it is to buy an original cart, or to *shudder* play the GBA remake. In either case, Nintendo doesn't produce them anymore, and the only way to get them is to buy them second hand (ergo no money going to Nintendo). Not to mention as you said the SNES version is in somewhat of a limited supply, and by buying one I'm taking a cart off the market from someone who may really be obsessive about playing originals (like Weezerjedi).

Also, spending 80 cents on ALttP is fuckin' ridiculous. I mean I can get a pack of fuckin' Hostess donuts for 80¢ and they're not even nearly as good as ALttP.

I don't think you understand what I'm saying. To put LttP up for sale online, the only cost is negligible (bandwidth). To produce donuts, it actually costs money. Looking at the sales of online music, I'd say putting up and 8Mbit cart for 80 cents is not so bad.

you say that $5 is a bad price for a 20 year old game, especially since in tact copies of some NES or SNES games are hard to come by nowadays and thus prices on them are constantly going up.

If I go down to my local pawn shop, I can find Super Mario World on sale for about $3. If I were to see LttP there, it'd probably be about the same price. Online might be a bit difference, I'd imagine an ebay sale of LttP in working condition (not mint) would be maybe $8 for an original cart. Hell, let's check my prediction:

long links make posts hard to read

Now at $6, 5 bids, 15 hours left. Probably when all is said and done someone will get it for under $8.

I should let you know that my TV is most likely bigger than your computer monitor. Also, my living room chair is more comfortable than my computer chair. I somehow think that fact holds true for you too.

I should let YOU know that my Xbox and PS2, both hacked, hook up to my big TV, which has a nice comfortable couch and lazyboy chair behind it. I should also let you know that my nice warm bed is a pretty great place to play my PSP.

Is your reason for bootlegging solely price, or do you have moral objection to playing the games?

Let's just get one thing clear: downloading full games has nothing to do with bootlegging. Bootlegging implies shady burned DVDs being sold in some chinese market at $1 a dozen. Now to answer your question, the primary thing is price. Spending $50 for a new game, or even $10 for a decade old game adds up when you play a lot of games.

Just curious. A lot of the books I've been reading lately deal with morals and the need or lack of need for laws to make the morals actually work.

Personally I don't think laws should deal with morals at all. I think that copyright infringement even now should be treated as a minor offense, mostly because current laws on the subject are completely restrictive and stifle creativity.

If no one bought games, then companies wouldn't make them and things like the virtual console would not exist..

But that's just it, I still buy games. I buy just as many as I did a year ago before I had any hacked consoles. Even on my Xbox, which I've had hacked since day one, I bought Shenmue 2 and Lego Star Wars. Since I hacked my PSP I bought Valkyrie Profile, MPO, Tekken: Dark Ressurection, Metal Gear Acid 2, and more. I also bought like 12 GameCube games in the less than a year since I bought it. Downloading games just allows me to play more games, and really that's all. If I didn't have a hacked PSP, I would have bought that same number of games, I've just been able to play a lot more without having to pay a king's ransom.

Honestly, if developers really want me to buy their games, offer good incentives for me to do so. Throw in a pack in deal, make a game so big that I'm unwilling to waste so much space on my memory stick, put in 3D glasses (hey, it made me buy MGA2!), or just make a game so spectacular I want to play it right away and don't want to wait for it to download.

All right, I read that in a weird order, not start to finish, so I'll respond in a weird order as well.

Beginning...now. Saying you're not stealing because you wouldn't have bought it in the 1st place is like saying you're not stealing from a person if you take a pencil out of their bag just because they would've given it to you if you asked. It's still for all intents and purposes, a crime and it is stealing. Also, just because it's a copywright infringement doesn't mean you're not stealing from them. Just because the law says it's 1 thing doesn't mean it's not another.

Also, none of this changes the fact that putting thoe emulators and roms on your PC or PSP or w/e is against the law since it's only legal if you can prove you own an original copy of the game and system.

Moving onward eBay auctions are far too unpredictable to say what they will or won't go for in 15 hours...I sold Nintendogs on eBay in October. In 10 hours it went from $14 to $23... Don't even try pulling any other bullshit with me on eBay either. Also, I don't care if you tell me you can get Super Mario World for $3, because that's a hell of a deal. If you get ALttP for $3, then that's a DAAAAAAAAAAAMN good deal.

Btw, I notice you have a hacked PS2 and Xbox. I don't think I should mention my point here.

Your comment on bootlegging is the most bullshit thing I've ever heard... A bootleg is an illegal copy of something that is distributed by a company to be made for profit. Bootlegs can range from being free DVDs, games, music CDs, or they could be versions of the mentioned things that are being distributed by someone other than the owner before the legal release date set by the owner of the said product.

I don't really know where I am in this message anymore so I'll skip to the ending comments of your message. Developers DO want you to buy games, but this is the VC we're talking about and you said, "make them so spectacular that I don't want to wait for it to download" but, I don't understand. On the VC you'd STILL have to wait for it to dl, so that really won't change your actions at all, thus invalidating your point. How about the fact that Nintendo's not charging you for their friend code based online service when you go online since they're using those games that people buy online to fund their online service.

Before I wrap up, I want to touch your reason for not paying for games on your emulators. You aren't paying a king's ransom with fucking $5, $8, or $10. Do you realize that a fuckin high school student, without a job, is apparently richer than you if you can't fucking afford that. Also, if you don't want to play games that cost money, then play a flash game, which no one pays money to make. Nintendo paid money back in the day when they made all these games. So did the 3rd party devs. It costed them money, so they're charging you to play them. It only makes sense after all. If I asked you to loan me $300 only I told you wouldn't you back a dime in the future, would you loan me that $300? Only if you were a rich/generous person. I know you're not the latter though.

Mericks wrote:Just because the law says it's 1 thing doesn't mean it's not another.

Actually, yes it does. Stealing involves the removal of property from another person, and the fact is by downloading roms or ISOs I've not removed any monetary value from them.

Also, none of this changes the fact that putting thoe emulators and roms on your PC or PSP or w/e is against the law since it's only legal if you can prove you own an original copy of the game and system.

And I care, why? It's a victimless crime and one I have no qualms about.

Moving onward eBay auctions are far too unpredictable to say what they will or won't go for in 15 hours..

Still damn well proves my point. They're up there for little price, even other ones on there in better contition were going for $10, $15 "Buy it now".

A bootleg is an illegal copy of something that is distributed by a company to be made for profit.

Let's consult the dictionary, shall we? "To produce, distribute, or sell without permission or illegally: a clandestine outfit that bootlegs compact discs and tapes." When have I done any of these thing?

but this is the VC we're talking about and you said, "make them so spectacular that I don't want to wait for it to download" but, I don't understand. On the VC you'd STILL have to wait for it to dl, so that really won't change your actions at all, thus invalidating your point.

That made absolutely no sense whatsoever. Also, I was speaking to Break's comments, which is exactly what I quoted.

Do you realize that a fuckin high school student, without a job, is apparently richer than you if you can't fucking afford that.

I -am- an unemployed high school student. Guess what? I have some 6.5 months before I go to the most expensive university in Canada. I need to get a job, or some more scholarships, and paying $8 for something which I can get easily for free and play in better circumstances is ridiculous to me.

If I asked you to loan me $300 only I told you wouldn't [give] you back a dime in the future, would you loan me that $300?

The analogy is not apt. In this case, it's more like I loan you $300, you pay me back $700, and then someone else comes along and takes a photograph of my stack of money. Honestly, it's of no cost to Konami if I download and play Castlevania: Harmony of Dissonance (which I've recently done). They've already made plenty of money, and the only way for me to legally play it would be to pay like $15 to EB so that I could play it on a less comfortable handheld with a tiny non-backlit screen.

Boy, that escalated quickly... I mean, that really got out of hand fast.

I'm tired of these long posts, so I'm gonna narrow it down to the 3 points I just read on the spot when the page loaded and I just scrolled down and stopped.

1. Your definition of "bootleg" is very clearly the verb form of the word, which isn't what we're talking about. We're talking about you playing bootleg games, not you actually bootlegging the games.

2. I would try explaining what I said about your point on "not wanting to wait for the dl" comment you made about developers since I clearly see you can't tell the difference between black and white. All there is to you apparently, is gray.

3. You're struggling to get into an expensive university, yet you say you ARE going there? When did you become psychic? Also, just because you can play the games for free, and definitely not in better circumstances doesn't mean you're not breaking the law. Also, try to think of this, Nintendo's a company out there for profit, and you're trying to get a profit too. See the link here? Your'e taking money from someone else so you can better your position. That means, DING, you're a bad persooooon. I don't give a shit about how rich Nintendo is either, you're both trying to gain money for a reason, and that means when you take money from them, you're being selfish. I don't care if it's $8, $100, $1 million, the large amounts are made of the bits and pieces and you're taking 1 of those pieces.

As I continue to read the rest of your post at the bottom of this screen, I notice 1 thing. You're a bad person who is clearly selfish, lacks morals, and clearly doesn't know how to define a word or doesn't know what an adjective and/or verb is.

I'm downloading Neverwinter Nights for Mac right now (a game I already have for Linux and Windows ironically). It's going at 15kb/s. It's about 2GB in size. Do the math.

Also, again, and try to understand it this time (maybe actually reading my posts would help you) I'm not taking any money from Nintendo by downloading games from them for free. They loose nothing, it's only gain for me. Furthermore, even if I were to download one of their new games, they wouldn't be loosing anything, I would just be gaining. Why? Well the only way you could possibly link copyright infringement to a monetary loss is to assume I would buy the game in the first place. Guess what? If I hadn't downloaded LttP, I would never have bought it. I would never have had the amazing experience of playing it 4 times over, and yet Nintendo's finances would still be no different then they are today.

As I continue to read your posts, I realize one thing: you're just a dick who'll pick a fight over anything. Go back to fucking your bible, morals are mine to decide and mine only.

How the hell did this war even begin anyway... ? we went from a PSP remake of rondo of blood to one huge debate on bootlegging games.

Vamp, they are charging money for this shit. When you take it for free, that's theft! Are you mentally damaged? Is it THAT hard to understand that fact? You have nothing to defend your point right there. Just because you aren't taking a physical cartrige doesn't mean you aren't taking the content that's contained on 1. THAT'S what they charge for in games. The cartriges, CDs, or DVDs are all the cheap parts of the game development process. The rest of the game they have to spend millions and millions of dollars on. It's just like a movie.

They charge everyone that money because they need to make up that millions of dollars they spend in development. Ever see those fucking previews in movies where they say, "Piracy, it's a crime."

It's because it's fucking stealing from the corporations that spent THEIR money in development for the thing you're stealing from them. If you want to play them, you get off your fucking ass, get some money, and PAY THEM for letting you have it you asshole.

Are you mentally defective? I don't care if they are selling these games... I'm still not taking anything of monetary value, no property from them, therefore it is not theft. Guess what? Those piracy previews lie to you. The fucking mafiaa lies to you, what a shock!

If they had a LttP rom on their servers which they sold for money and I hacked into them, downloaded the game using their bandwidth, then I might consider it theft. But guess what! That's not what happens in the slightest. As I already said, in the present state, the only way to call what I do stealing would be to assume that I was going to buy it in the first place. I recently downloaded the Power Stone Collection for PSP. Much as the game is mildly enjoyable, I would not have bought it. I would not even have played it if I had not downloaded it.

Furthermore, I play games because I want to play games, not because I want to fuel the machine of capitalism. Using that same mechanism, they could simply offer a better product then I can get online for free in order to get me to purchase a game, but guess what! They offer an inferior product as far as I'm concerned from Nintendo's Virtual Console.